Good day (maybe not depending on how you take this topic),

This is what i'm doing now: *Awaiting another PM from a mod telling me I'm here to snap down members*

There are times that i laugh myself death with certain threads on this board, while i should burst out in tears to see how lame the content is.

Just face it ******** your board is poluted with fxpkiddies and defacers, if you ask me to compare GSO with how it is now and how it used to be 4yrs ago ... well Sorry but this board has been rotting for over 2-3 years now. And so i feel myself obliged to break down the board hoping you will finally see that what you do now is not good.

One example is the, sorry to say, idiotic tutorial on JAcheck, in my years of experience as a network administrator i only find jacheck (and jastat) on hacked servers and NOWHERE else. Continuing my comment on this "tutorial" well i posted a reply with the readme which contains more information and better information. If you know your tutorial is useless compared to the readme DO NOT POST IT, if someone asks something about this and it can be found in the readme post the readme instead of writing up a 3rd rank tutorial. By the way, in case you fxpkiddies did not know sfv uses CRC32 which means you can make a foolproof check up to files of sizes of an unsigned long (a little bit more than 4mb) which is not big enough for your 15mb warez archives used in your "scene" (this is CE, if you dont understand it: buy teach yourself c in 21days). Only saying this proves these people to be stuborn and dumb a the same time.

Now that i'm writing, and know that i will most likely get removed from this board I will open the gates and give this board a full load.

The autohackers OH MY GOD, can it be more obvious that the only people who think this is usefull are the FXPkiddies who want to hack as many "stros" as possible within a certain period of time, preferrably less than one second? If you want to ACT (sorry but only 0.1% of this board is in my eyes a real hacker) like a real hacker you have 3 possibilties, or you write up a framework which automates any given exploit, or you code your own exploit or (i even think this is lame) you edit the exploit's sourcecode so it is automated. And pretty please .bat source codes may be found usefull for your own use, but when posting something on the internet please do TRY to code them in a decent language like perl / python / C / VB, anything but batch.

Every exploit is being discussed on this board, finally a good point ... but then lame fxpkiddies & defacers start posting nothing but "where is the scanner", "how do i compile this exploit", "On what port does the vulnerable program run" and last but not "What is this?". If they only did the effort using google or most of the time just READ the exploit source code they would find themself pleased because they would get a GOOD answer faster than any reply. Oh yea, these quotes are REAL and can be found on this board!!! Check it yourself if you do not believe me.

Now my will to write more is gone, i've made myself pissed only THINKING about these reply's, they make me puke on your board. I wish it would have been otherwise but this is the truth. GSO gets no respect from any security company anywhere over the world (unless they are of the same level).

This post is not meant to be a personal offence to anyone on this board but the board itself. People need to start somewhere, but pretty please make them start at a certain level, not by making them code idiotic autohackers which prove to be the kiddie way out. If you want people to become hackers, well then at least do some effort by making them think the way a hacker thinks, I am 100% sure that almost noone on this board understands what mephisto wrote in his short message concerning hacking. This guy doesnt say how you need to hack step by step but he tells you how to think.

I accept a removal with no questions asked, I dont want to be part of this board no longer anyway as long as it keeps this freezing low level. The only thing i ask is that you administrators and moderators do something about the quality of this board, because really this isn't a security board anymore this is a "Teach your grandma how to hack" board with almost no usefull information at all.

Jetprice.

PS: Please, PLEASE,, PRETTY PLEASE do not post 1 line replys telling I am a frog, this would only prove that you are ... not going to say it, read what i wrote and you will most likely know which word i would be using there.

PPS: i tried to be as friendly as possible but i need to use some words as otherwise you would not take me for real.

PPPS: 4yrs ago i used to be here under a different account.

i think your comments are a little harsh. it's true that we've had problems with fxp kiddies polluting the board, but certainly in the last 6 month we have worked very hard to remove these types of posts and strictly enforce the rules.

we even closed membership to stop the kiddies rejoining.

perhaps you could make some positive suggestions on how we can improve our image in the security professional field rather than just rubbish the board...

I agree with jetprice. Its not just trying to stop script kiddies from joining and being a burden, cause you actually prevent good people from joining as well. But as professionals, we need to help this culture to understand the ethics and morals of simply messing with others, just for fun. They would think differently if they had to go through their identity being stolen, and return to a normal life. Or lossing what secureness they thought they had by using their computer. Its like your house being broken into, its hard to feel safe to return. We should not discourage people from experiencing the Internet because some jack azz had fun and "0wn3d" em.

tossed in my 0.02

Yes my thread is harsh for sure as it is meant to be that way, sorry for that but otherwise noone would pay attention to it, and as you are replying to my thread i think i succeeded.

Well positive remarks a few topics down in this section i saw that comsec removed almost 15.000 0-posters well thats good start on how to make the board clean but its not clean enough as there are still people posting lame things like autohackers, tutorials for applications who have decent help files or readme's. Some tutorials ARE usefull and even very usefull, I never said the whole board is f*cked up, i said that a huge amount of the members here should not bother with hacking either because they do not have enough experience with their computer OR because they simply use hacking tools for the wrong purposes. Too be hounest I'm really surprised that the FBI didnt knock your door down because of some people on this board, but thats just me.

I'm not saying you have to kick everyone, what I'm saying is read some of the topics see who posts usefull information and who doesnt. Those who only post crap send them a PM and ask them friendly to stop posting it. If they dont just boot them, this is YOUR board and thus NO democracy! It is up to YOU if you do something or not, you can say jetprice go buzz off, we like these lamers.. its your good right and i wont bother with it, but then please do remove me.

How to remove lamers well thats just intensive reading of threads and PMing those who do not apply to what you think should be posted, as i said previously. Remember you cant have a board that is 100% kiddie-free, to have such a board you need to apply your rules from the start, not when you have like 30000 members, then its too late, you will always have a kiddie hiding in the dark.

Anyway this is more or less how i would do this, of course this is nowhere near kiddieproof. Therefor i suggest ALL moderators and administrators gather in the near future to discuss this and come up with a solution themselves, I'm not running this board I'm just saying what should be changed in order to get at least some respect in the security scene.

If you have any further questions dont hesitate and ask me.

jetprice - nearly everyday i send someone a pm warning about their crappy one word post, or hack request etc and usually i increase their warning level to discourage such activity.

i am not sure what else can be done. we can get harsher and ban more quickly, but i personally believe in second chances.

second chance yes ... but 10 chances ?


Just discuss it with all mods & admins, i hope you will do this as otherwise nothing will change i think

People don't seem to realize the logistics involved in a forum of this size. Sure we can go hard against every post and we'll be able to easily reduce the number of script kiddies on the forum. But that will come at the expense of free speech. Do you guys really want to be part of a forum where you have to second guess every post you make for fear of getting banned?



Now jetprice, that line was directed at me and since you decided to take this issue out of pm and make a topic about it...I will reply to you here.

Yes I don't want you to snap down our members. Because, either I nor the other mods want to deal with flame/spam threads. When you antagonize or instigate members, regardless if they're script kiddies, the thread normally erupts into a back and forth immature argument. And honestly we don't want to deal with that.

Furthermore, who are you to look down on any of the member regardless of what skill in network security they have? I've been looking through your posts today and I have not found a single tutorial or worthwile contribution.

If you think that a post is crap or a member is a script kiddy take it up with us. Do not degrade or antagonize that person.

And I'll bring this up again...whats the deal with taking up a private correspondance in a patronizing and lecturing thread. I sent you a private message about your posts...you deal with that message with me. This kind of childish and immature crap that we have to deal with is far worse than any script kiddy post.

Well to be hounest i dont contribute because of the reasons i just gave, as i said i used to be on this board under a different nickname years ago, back then i DID contribute.

I have this personal rule: dont give kiddies something they can use, being whitehat i think that you should keep that in mind..

Also i said you should have been applying your rules from the start on, you never did and now you have a problem with kiddies, sorry but thats a bit hypocritic (or however you write it, english is not my native language).

Oh yea nothing personal, i might have used you yes, and at least you are actively participating to this thread, would you still have done this if i didnt use your PM? To be hounest, looking at the amount of replys, i doubt that. Social engeneering is a hacking skill as far as i know, lol, dont take this to seriously though. Continuing on this issue, well if you didnt have the huge amount of kiddies on this board you would not have bothered with me as the thread simply wouldnt exist.

But lets make one thing clear, I created this thread because i feel that this would improve YOUR board, I could have said nothing and wait for someone else to write this down, he or she would have written it differently yes, but thats not the issue. The problem of GSO was and is kiddies, you're board is known all over the world wouldn't it be nice to be respected all over the world? Because hounestly it's not

GSO stands for security i guess, then why is 90% of the members fxpkiddie? They ABuse security instead of contacting the administrator telling them they have (a) serious hole(s) in their system.

Oh yea once i find that GSO is almost kiddie-free i WILL contribute, as long as that is not the case i will not, if you feel that you must kick or ban me for this reason go ahead I would feel honoured. Also I'm quite confident that there are more members like me who do not contribute because of the reasons I give, but that of course is a personal opinion.

And please if you really want to be able to code autohackers learn something on how to code in .bat, i've seen the worst .bat code ever written here and nowhere else.

Regards,

jetprice.

PS: The numbers i use is how it seems to me, its not because i say it that by definition 90% of the members is kiddie .

PPS: I dont care about the little issue we had, I cant help it that things i read on this board make me pissed, SOME level is required and coding (.bat) autohackers is to me even worse than flaming a member because everyone can do that too. command /?

We have been going after script kiddy posts from the start. I'm sorry if this happens "behind the scenes" and is not that apparent to the public. We pm and trash blatantly malicious posts every day.

But like I said before, to me at least, free speech on an internet board is much more important. So I do and will continue to give some leeway to people in the posts they make.

You're missing the point in my original private message to you. Do not antogonize our members. I don't want to have to moderate between two or more people calling each other names and flaming threads. Its a hassle that we don't want to deal with. If you think someone made a script kiddy post, ignore it and message one of us. Don't reply to that post and call that person a script kiddy.



Please don't try to martyr yourself. If you site down and think about it you'll realize how childish and pathetic and even funny it sounds. Its not really something to feel honored about.

Thats where you and me differ.

I do NOT want to be part of a security board full with kiddies, so if you kick me now and dont change it i would feel honoured, nothing childish about this. Rather the oposite

As a matter of fact i find you to be the child here talking more off topic than on topic, you being a moderator should take this thread seriously which you are not doing. But go ahead, as long as you keep nagging about this PM you sent me do so because i will not continue putting effort in replying to it.

Luckily i do find one sensfull piece of text and that is asking the members to actively report kiddie threads.

We are taking it seriously. I'm sorry if we're not rushing to action and deleting members left and right. We are throwing around ideas right now to limit undesirable members. First of all, the entire staff has not seen this thread yet so no action can be taken until they do. Things don't change immediately especially in a forum of this size.

What I'm asking you is, for the time being, not to antagonize the members. If you think a thread is bad then let one of us know. Do not take it upon yourself to deal with it. Thats what I'm talking about. When you antagonize someone, this is the kind of spam that results.

Finally I'm getting to you! And to be hounest i really do feel pleased about this matter.

I dont ask of you to immediatly ban people, first talk, then talk some more with the people who moderate and administer this forum and then go over to action. I find this way of working perfect as there should always be time to talk, also if there are kiddies who want to participate, as long as you think you can behave yourself (i did so too so far in this thread) then dont hesitate and post your opinion on this matter, just dont start fooling around as this wouldn't be the perfect thread for doing this .

In reply to your question on kiddie-posts: I will not reply to any kiddie thread anymore, at least i'll try cuz it sometimes really is hard not replying, instead i will report them as you kindly ask of me.

A slightly satisfied jetprice.

Well I had a good reply to this till the power went out..lol So here it is again.

I am not sure if I contribute much or anything for that matter. But I do know that to many people ask the no-no questions. and the mods/admins take care of it asap. How can you stop it? Simply put, you cannot. The reason is because you cannot predict what someone is going to post. So you show me a board where there is no scriptkid requests and I'll show you a board of only 5 members and no public access and what the hell good would a board be if you only had 5 members all of which more then likly talk more on a IM or live near each other and not public? I also live by the rule that ( and I may be the only person in the entire world to think this ) I do not care what people think of me or what I do. So I care not if other boards/sites think we are good or not. I found gov sec becuse I was looking for a adult place to discuss security related things. Just so happens the board is full of open minded people unlike some other security boards I have checked out. So I think rippin into the "board" is not right. I also like the idea of given a second chance. I do agree with your scriptkid comments but I think if you want changes you need to have constructive criticism. If you unload all your anger at someone you will shut them down and they will just ignore you and your thoughts. I personally don't compile code for expolits. I like to tear into windows using only the tools windows gives us. My favorite is the registry. I can sit in there all day changin keys and trying things so see what effects happens. granted it is extremely hard to do it but funner if you find something. Anyway thats my 2cents. Take it for what it's worth.

late


kv-

Hi Jetprice,


I haver been on this forum a few years now aswell you have made a valid point about some people here are useless and i agree but i believe the MODS do an outstanding job of banning/warns and even closing registration to stop people like you mention joining GSO.

On the other hand you say this board is on its way out, i diasagree, on this board we have IT pro's , AV pro's allsorts. grey black and white can all hang out here if they respect the rules and feed of each others enthuasiam for the same goals (or not), This is what makes GSO unique, i mean whitehats learn from black etc etc and so everyone seems to be happy here.
I agree with you script kiddies are annoying but without them posting some info we wouldnt know what they where up too until a IT pro saw it on a r00td server or a honeypot.

I just wanted to get this point across as GSO will be around for a long time becuase of this, When GSO went up for sale you cannot imagine the size of the community would be lost, i mean who wants to hang around on IRC all day? (sorry kuerby n serhat ) but here everyone has a say and every one is allowed a point of view (call it freedom of speech if you will).

p.s. i just wanted to say on the autohacker issue, i support 100+ VPNS from a centralist location, how better way to ext my clients security? , there are some of us who respect the rules

I can find myself in your reply, I dont care what you people think of me aswell, and i also believe in 2nd chances. The thing is that there is a limit for everything, you can post something you find usefull while i think it is kiddie crap. Thats not the point the point is that i see the same members posting the same things again and again and again.

But i do have something to tell you, yeayea i always do, wouldn't it be nice to extend your knowledge of the windows security if the people who post here post usefull and interessting information or tools instead of stupid autohackers, seems that i really have something against this.

I thikn that if you make this board kiddie-free, which is indeed not possible, but lets say you get the oposite nr you have now (so 10% kid, 90% intelligent) I am quite confident that you will be receiving better information.

And well I do think that you should pay attention to what the board is worth to the outside world especially if you want to deal with kiddies yourself, i find that you think partly the same way about this matter as i do. Just open the image as i see it and tell me if you can find yourself in this:

gso gets respect > people will spread words > both kiddies as professionals will now be willing to join up.

Now where lies the difference, the difference is that at this very moment not too many (if not none) professionals who are jumping to post their experience in this board while that is what you are aiming for: good, usefull and interessting information.

Regards,

jetprice.

i think another interesting aspect to this, is that having some greyhats on board at least keeps security professionals in the picture as to what new threats to be aware of.

To me, GSO is a place to discuss security related issues. Whether I discuss it with a network admin or someone who writes malware is irrelevent. Both can provide useful new information and so long as the content of posts are not illegal or inciting illegal behaviour, i see no problem of seeing both sides of the picture.

Andydis, what you say i do find interessting but once again i come up with a reply.

You say that IT profs now have a chance to see what kiddies do, well this is true, but what i say is that kiddies find there information on boards like this, so if you cut their access down on boards like this one they simply wont be able to apply all this information.

Autohackers can be written by everyone, they do not belong in here, if you cant code a .bat autohacker you are not on the right place <period>!

And lets be hounest are you able to code those .bat autohackers? Looking at some of your posts i'm quite confident you will.

If you want autohackers simply learn perl its very easy to use and very fast to write down some simple but usefull code. Look at metasploit THAT is how you need to code your autohackers.

Sorry tibbar but i've never seen a kiddie post something usefull, and i seriously mean never. If you think posting a new version of metasploit is interessting well then my reply is: RSS.

I dont say it isn't usefull to post tools, but i only find it usefull when the members discuss the tool instead of how to use it to own that specific ip adres, i mean take metasploit everyone just wants to know how to use the exploits it contains, if they only knew the real power of metasploit..

On the other hand real blackhats, those with the goal to destroy a society by hacking it do not talk about their experiences in the field, forget it really they wont do that at all. And for me that is the real danger along with kiddies who try to own the world so they can spread their warez.

Ok now i'm going to sleep, and when i wake up i expect all kiddies to be banned from this board!!!!

hehe, ^^that last phrase is a joke of course

Jetprice.

I won't start on flaming jetprice its not worth so ill just say this. You could call me a sriptkiddie, well actually I am a script kiddie. I'm just starting out in the security scene at 15 yrs of age, and yes i have started with batch files, learning as much as i can and have just started on C++ as adivised by many of the tutorials and posts by the members. And whats wrong with coding something in .bat if it is effective and does what is needed?????? Just because it's easier then other codeing languages doesn't make it lame etc.

Yes i will agree there are some stupid things posted on these forums, the admins can't stop them all. After I gained my member status i was slightly disapointed with the new sections, exploit discusion and downloads, because of some of the posts but you get that in every forum. And who are you to look down on the members, we have to start somewhere and regardless of the stupidity of some script kiddies posts this is a good place to start.

And complaining like this and saying you won't make decent post because of all the scripties etc is a cop out. And obviously when you started this you didn't think of how much effort the admins put in.

thats my 2cents. it hink its around 8 cents total now

EDIT: I take some of that back jetprice is contributing now that his problem is sorted.

-toe

Shoot me, but jetprice, you might not be a skiddie, but you have the interlect of one.



Specialists ? I dont post anything about exploits, because i dont use exploits. I post in Linux and Windows Security, and i post about lower level hacking. You know why ? Because i know those topics like the back of my hand. If your complaining that I (well, we) post about the same thing over and over, thats because I (we) know the topic well and have decided to take that on personally...

I may take this one a little personally, but oh well. Its people like you that i hate, your flame every person you can because you think you know more than them. In some areas fine, but their learning, and if you know everything, then delete your own account, because if i had access, i'd make sure yours was loooong gone.

Autohackers, omfg, how lame ?!?!??!?! In a batch file ??!??! OMFG THATS SO UBER SKIDDIE ! Dude, didnt your mother ever say if you dont have something nice to say, dont say anything ? The mods (BN in this case) shoot people for one word "THANKS" replies, which is good, great even. Then you think its ok to post flames because your not thanking anyone ?

In year 6, i started programming in QBasic, i didnt have the internet back then, nor any family in computers. So i always asked help from my mates, they ALWAYS stayed patient with me, they've now gone off and doing non-IT related jobs, but if it wasnt for them trying to help me out, I would never have been here trying to help others.

Pretty much, stfu, as someone else said, your just as bad because you havent even offered any solutions, so easy to condemn. My god, this is a security board, and many others exist. What makes this board so unique is the fact that it has so many grey and black hats on it. Go look at anti-online. You want security news, thats a great site. But most of that information can be found from mailing lists anyway.. But the reason why people still use that and not use mailing lists / google, is because of open discussion, free trade of thought.

Im a very patient person, usually just ignore the people that the i dont think are worth it. I dont flame them, and in IRC im always the first to help out...

My god jetprice, stop being a b***h and be a man. Help others and be patient. No-one knows all, and its boards like this where security professionals are born, they dont just all go "oh, i know heaps about security im now able to join that board" its "im interested in security and want to know more about it" or people like you "Hey, look, theres a security board with a skiddie, FLAME"

This board has members of all race, sex, and age. Take a note from the mentor, its his comments that you should relate to, not mephist's...

I dont hate the skiddies, I hate the know it all's

As to be expected there should always be someone who needs to flame my ass. For once i've been friendly but you just couldn't leave it be right.

Well as the back of your hand you must also know that its USELESS to post those autohackers with only one intention which is providing automated scripts so even my grandma can hack a server. This is NOT hacking not even security this is just blunt posting so you get respect for actually doing nothing. I do nothing, and most of the time say nothing, but i certainly do not occupy myself by "coding" (if you can call it coding) automated scripts. But even if you consider autohackers as a valid thing, lets go out from that point now, then why do i see the most ugly code in the universe posted? .bat coding is really easy and i still see people posting bat-scripts that contain huge flaws or 5lines that can be reduced to 1or 2. If i just read the .bat code i already know that almost none of those who post them know how to get the usage of a command in the console!

In case you didn't know hacking foreign networks is illegal, wherefor would you need autohackers, any network administrator can make an autohacker if they need it. While most of the time you dont need to hack yourself you just need to download patches and apply them. You do NOT need autohackers, the only purpose they CAN have is for "0wn1ng" as you guys like to say a huge amount of "stros".

But anyway ... if you say you normally dont flame, why do you flame in a thread like this where every mod and admin will have a look into. Personally i think you are dumb, no very dumb for doing this, this is not meant as flame but just a fact. If i may quote you:



I think your words are very appropriate to quote at this very moment, you should at least try to restrain yourself and your language as what you do now is just flame me.
The well known trick of saying "i normally dont flame" means you are flaming now, I am no fool and at least i read what other people write, which you obviously did not do. This thread is meant to talk about this problem so the mods & admins can find an even more effective way of killing kiddies from their board, as a matter of fact i ask them for this they dont even have to agree. You on the other hand... no I'm going to stop or i will start flaming myself, at least i know how to restrain myself.

I do know the amount of effort the admins put in, i just think its not good enough, its my good right to say so and if you can't live with that then that would be your problem not mine. I did spread some ideas on what you might try to do in order to remove kiddies, and now i will say one thing: READ BEFORE YOU REPLY! I know by just reading your reply that you only read the main post, you didnt even put in any effort reading any other of my replys, then why am i actually talking to you? Yes right because i think that everyone can have his or her opinion and is allowed to post it anywhere unless the rules forbid you to do so. In my case I AM allowed to do so, and thus at this very moment I feel that you are trying to take my right of free speech. How dare you talk about this if you try to take this from me? You literaly say you hate people like me, if you dont call that flame then I am santa with a dick up his arse, if i may be so harsch.

Anyway, I asked for kiddies to post their thoughts and so here i have them now, thanks guys. At least now i know how you feel about this, obviously offended, can't blame you for it.

Another thing, you say this is a community for anyone black/grey/whitehat and even kiddie to post their thoughts and experiences. But now that one says his opinion you come in attacking me as a person, that is not very nice of you i think.

I did not report this reply, but please, pretty please, do try to keep in mind that I will do so if you do this again.

Regards,

jetprice.

(as I write this, I noticed that I didn't organize my thoughts that well so try to disregard the messy order).

If I may ask... why is learning about how someone breaks in -- kiddie or not -- a bad thing? (I suspect I missing something critical). The reason why I ask this is that I'm a supporter of "full disclosure" and believe that if I understand how an attack is done, whether with finesse or a click, it might help me better figure out how to protect against something.

There are somethings that I have picked up here that I haven't seen mentioned elsewhere because it's a "script kiddie" activity. Heck, I hadn't even heard of fxp until I came here. Personally, I believe that all learning is a good thing, no matter how small or insignificant it may seem. If we look at things entirely in a negative manner then it will remain negative. If we look for the positive, that is try to find out how this can be used to create defenses or what-have-you, then it has benefit.



Bolding added by me. How is he trying to take away your "right to free speech"? Granted in the US you are allowed "freedom of speech". That is, the government (IIRC) isn't allowed to prevent you from saying or writing things that are contrary to the government or are in support of your own defined religion. Private forums, however, are not necessarily ruled by this. AFAIK, it is technically a privilege not a right. If the mods/admins choose to close/trash this thread they can do so. And they are, IMO, the only ones that can take away one's ability of "free speech" here.

While you may not agree with his post, he has as much right to post it as you do to counter it. Both are merely opinions, not fact. To suggest he's "dumb" would mean that you've done an empirical test to prove this (perhaps you have but I haven't seen the results and I have stats to counter your stats, so nyahh )

Now that all said, if I can offer my two and a half cents (damn exchange rate). Regardless of where I visit I'm finding that there is a flood of "newbies" (and I'll call them that because they range from those wanting to be hackers, ala Swordfish, to those that really want to learn and get involved but don't know where to start) in the security field and sites that are related to it. Even mailing lists are being infected to a degree (although that seems to have a little less noise).

I would suggest, however, that if you don't like the content then perhaps add stuff that you want to see. If you show others what is expected or what would be good on a forum like this, then they may follow suit. But doing nothing and being an, if you will the comparison, an "armchair quarterback" doesn't help, IMO. I would be interested in seeing some things that are more interesting. Beardednose did start some really good discussions on what makes security (people, process or technology) as well as what is "reasonable". Granted, not technical stuff but truly difficult material to deal with.

This forum is as good as the content that is put forward by individuals. The ol' "the whole is greater than the sum of the parts" applies here. Personally, I like GSO. I think it has a lot to offer. And much like a lot of the internet I have to filter through some things and read the things I want to. But that is part of what the internet is about since everyone wants to voice their own opinion.

But, what do I know?

Answer on paragraph one:

You dont need to understand how to install a patch, hacking is most of the time abusing a coding failure of the manufactured software, taking microsoft as an example you will not be able to do anything about it as its closed-source. So invalid argument. If you say open ports, i say router.

Answer on second paragraph:

The fact that this is the first place where you hear about fxp must mean that the problem is real. As far for the negative thing, i complain asking for a positive solution, so once again invalid argument.

Paragraph 3:

None of the rules say that i'm not allowed to make a post like this, moderators may close this thread indeed as that is their right while i have the right to post it. These are 2 different things, know what you are talking about instead of using all that brainpower for difficult words... Other than that freedom of speech is no priviledge it is a right, maybe not in the us but in my country it is and sorry to say but things run way better in my country... this is no offence to any american at all just a fact.

Paragraph 4:

I didnt flame in this topic he did, while all mods and admins read this. Therefor i think he is dumb, logical thinking instead of impirical thinking.

Paragraph 5:

Good joke but then again i never said anything is kiddie-free, what i do say is that should be a goal. It can never be successfull but i prefer less kiddies over more kiddies.

Paragraph 6:

I'm not going to repeat myself for the 3rd time, and i also never said that all posts are bad, i say that this board is known for its kiddielevel instead of its professional level. If i say GSO to any of my friends the answer is "kiddie" all the time... thats gotta say something right?

Paragraph 7:

Correct, and maybe you dont know but i used to like GSO aswell, ... but that was 4yrs ago, all that time i've been waiting for huge changes while i only saw minor changes. The problem GSO has is that they didnt apply strict rules in the beginning of their existance and now have a serious problem with it, you can't blame them for not anticipating this no, but you can ask them to try to do more than they do now, its up to them to decide, the only thing i want to do is try to push them a little bit.


You know what you know , nothing more nothing less.

[quote] You dont need to understand how to install a patch, hacking is most of the time abusing a coding failure of the manufactured software, taking microsoft as an example you will not be able to do anything about it as its closed-source. So invalid argument. If you say open ports, i say router. [/QUOTE]

Only if it is specifically a technical problem. There are certainly others that aren't. And patches don't always work. (e.g., NT with SP6). If patches are the solutions to everything, why even talk about security? As we know, ala Microsoft, exploits are "only written after the patches are released".

[quote]Answer on second paragraph:

The fact that this is the first place where you hear about fxp must mean that the problem is real. As far for the negative thing, i complain asking for a positive solution, so once again invalid argument.[/quote]

Perhaps from your point of view. Maybe you've seen so much more. I look at it as opening up more information for me to understand what goes on elsewhere. I don't think I've ever seen it mentioned in mainstream media or even some of the security lists.

[quote]Paragraph 3:

None of the rules say that i'm not allowed to make a post like this, moderators may close this thread indeed as that is their right while i have the right to post it. These are 2 different things, know what you are talking about instead of using all that brainpower for difficult words... Other than that freedom of speech is no priviledge it is a right, maybe not in the us but in my country it is and sorry to say but things run way better in my country... this is no offence to any american at all just a fact.[/quote]

I'm not in the US but your comment about Freedom of Speech made me think that you were. That said, what country are you in since I've only heard the US go on about this particular PoV and applying it to private forums as "gospel"?

[quote]Paragraph 4:

I didnt flame in this topic he did, while all mods and admins read this. Therefor i think he is dumb, logical thinking instead of impirical thinking. [/quote]

Then it's an opinion or point of view, not fact.

[quote]Paragraph 5:

Good joke but then again i never said anything is kiddie-free, what i do say is that should be a goal. It can never be successfull but i prefer less kiddies over more kiddies.[/quote]

And they may be attempting to reach that goal. I don't think, however, that it will be reached easily or without huge censorship. It's a hard fine line to hold. IMO, heavy moderation may kill a lot of the creativity and ideas that a unique from flourishing.

[quote]Paragraph 6:

I'm not going to repeat myself for the 3rd time, and i also never said that all posts are bad, i say that this board is known for its kiddielevel instead of its professional level. If i say GSO to any of my friends the answer is "kiddie" all the time... thats gotta say something right? [/quote]

Are your friends members? Are they just basing it on what they hear from others? Have you asked them explicitly why they view it as such? Their response could be the result of a variety of things from their own experiences to rumors they have heard. Additionally, how many people are saying this? 1? 2? 5? 100? 100,000?

I ask these questions because I have little context in which to weigh the comment (at least from my view point). I'm not saying that this is an "elite" security site. The few forums that I've seen that are 100% security are also relatively dead (case in point: ISC2 CISSP forums; although task.to seems to have a bit more activity).

[quote]Paragraph 7:

Correct, and maybe you dont know but i used to like GSO aswell, ... but that was 4yrs ago, all that time i've been waiting for huge changes while i only saw minor changes. The problem GSO has is that they didnt apply strict rules in the beginning of their existance and now have a serious problem with it, you can't blame them for not anticipating this no, but you can ask them to try to do more than they do now, its up to them to decide, the only thing i want to do is try to push them a little bit.[quote]

Hrmm. Times do change, whether we like it or not. I liked the Internet in the mid-90s. It was personal and fun. You learned things. You WANTED to learn things (now there's a concept). It was about exploration.

Now, it's a big freakin' ad (I swear, I find the schmuck who decided that HTML would be a good thing to add to email and he's going to learn a whole new meaning to "slapped with a trout") to sell something that you don't have (enlarge this part, that part, get your mortage -- even if you don't have a house, we want to watch where you go, how you go and when you go). It's not about information for the sake of education. It's about information for the sake of the all mighty buck. (hrmm... I think I sense certain issues I need to deal with).

That said (and ranted about), perhaps you can make suggestions as to specifics as to how to achieve solutions to the present situation as you view it here on GSO. Is it simple strict post moderation that will solve it? is it perhaps advertising to security professionals to get more to participate, thus outnumbering the "kiddies" (although I do wonder sometimes what a security professional is based some activities on certain lists a little while ago)? Perhaps mentoring some of the kiddies as to the benefits of being a security professional and where it will take them in the long run rather than getting to know "bubba" for a long run?

Or maybe it's just too early in the morning to have such deep thoughts?

Things to ponder for now.

[quote]
You know what you know , nothing more nothing less.
[/quote]

Now that's a scary thought.

[edit] Ok weird. I know I have the quote tags right but they aren't working? (mod help?)

Ahem, "Know thy enemy"
I find the garbage useful regardless of how poorly written it is because it tells us what people are up. If the whole board consisted purely of Whitehats then we would have no idea what the Blackhats or script kiddies do and how they do it.

Personally i dont have a problem with you commenting on the people who make autohackers or actions of script kiddies (in an adult manner). hell go for your life, i mean in the end this is just a web forum (a mighty fine one at that!).

autohackers / botnets are good examples of an only blackhat utility. Everyone knows that. If they want to use autohackers, fine, leave'em be.

Skiddies suck, but we all we're one day. We all tried many hacking programs, most of us not knowing what the hell we were running (and in windows mind you :P)

But we (well, atleast I) have learnt from those programs. It started the basics of hacking, and you know what, if it didnt work the first time, i ditched it. I was a certified script kiddie. Netbus ! Everyone remembers that, basically legit program gone abused. BUT that taught me about Client Server relationships, taught me about fundamental networking. Got me excited. Let them get excited.

I did read all your posts (jetprice), all 90 of them. There nothing to boast about :P

You can spot a skiddie from a mile away, but their like insects, they just keep comming back, and some of them do turn into hackers in their next lives. Dont shoot them down..

imho, this board is split into 3 sections. Black Hats (from skiddies, to people just wanting exploits etc, of all levels), Security Enthusiats (Not just ideling in Exploit-Research and Discussion) and Trial Members. I only really speak with the security enthusiasts. I ignore the autohax0rs threads, and trial member boards (however, good content does get pasted in there).

Jetprice, you obviously know something more than a skiddie, dont give yourself a bad name with a post as direct as this.

If you find a security forum as unique as this with no skiddies. PLEASE SEND ME THE LINK !

Sorry dude, but, theres nothing major that can be done. Im sure the admins and mods are all up for suggestions...

----------------------------------- Staying away from the flaming side of it -------------------------------------

If your up for it, im happy for a nice little discussion about it.

A) What are we trying to remove ?

B) How do we identify them ?

C) How do we remove them ?

imho, im happy with the users on here, im not happy with the flammers. But, i'll berwith you for this moment.

So far, in place we have trial members, but its easy for a bad apple to get through. Also, closed registration during holidays etc. But some bad apples can get through.

Other than watching each user for bad posts, then killing their access, i dont see too many ways around it. And thats already in place.

Chances are, they've probably reduce the numbers by up to 70% with the measures already in place.... How many other have those 3 phase skiddie reduction practices (that sounds kinda cool) in place ?

Other than that, all i can think of is these two:

1) a) well, like vbullietin has with their points system. Ie AntiOnline, seems half decently effective but not really designed to restrict members so this could be tweak by GSO to incorp. it. Or adding our own voting system, like a much much more advance Warning system thats in place.

B) Post Count, there arent too many stupid posts out there, so this maybe effective at getting dedicated members, who've been here for awhile to post in more restricted channels, but once again, this removes the whole 'free information' theory most of us live by

2) 3 Phase Interviews ? Ie, trial member, prospect then full member. Trial as it is, Prospect, or Private First Class can have un restricted views(?) but restrict posts, then once the users say he's cool, then let him in....

Actually, thinking about 2 might work. If users could give yay or nay votes, 100 votes would allow the user to be evaluated, if say more than 50% say yes, then he's in. If not he's out....

Well, its not easy thinking of ways of reducing tardism, wanna contribute jetprice ?

I'd avoid it, IMO. At first it sorta works but you then run into a specific problem that has become somewhat of a plague of the karma system (the points system in VBulletin): people begin to assign points because they like the person or don't like the way someone writes rather than on the content. It's nice to boolster up those that do good but there are many who get points just because they post rather than because they have content.

Additionally the actual karma system (known as AntiPoints at AO) has changed since it's first implementation. When it started, it was anonymous and you could go as low as possible. I remember some members having 6 red buttons (means they were in -600 points). This was changed to a max of -300, which, when reached, resulted in the member getting a ban (four hours sticks in my mind). All APs assignments were anonymous. Bad idea. Lots of abuse was done (and probably still is to a degree) with alliances (same user/multiple accounts or groups of users coordinating to neg someone) or with APs being assigned and claiming them to be from someone else.

Lately, the anonymity was removed and I'm quite sure we've seen a drop in the number of negs. People don't want others to know I suspect (sorta like companies not wanting bad PR) that they disapprove for whatever reason unless it's directed to a newb.

It also tends to create an even greater "us" versus "them" attitude, IMO. Some who have lots of APs aren't necessarily good at security or even contribute a lot to the security discussions. And some think themselves better than others because they have numerous positive APs. And for some, lord forbid if they get negatives, the world will fall apart.

Personally, simply implementing a technological solution wouldn't necessarily be a good thing. There are many ways that this can (and has been and will continue to) be abused.

The voting idea as you suggest is good. I'd add an option to have comments made to support the vote. That is, if you vote positively for someone, indicate why (that is, what is it they bring to GSO that is of benefit to users).

The downside to all this is that those that are truly new may be shut out of the process since they may not have enough to bring to the process and won't learn to get beyond the "newbie" stage. And I don't think that's a benefit.

OK

Well, how about if we remove the negative points ?

After a quick google, seems that no-one has yet created this type of system for invision.

So this would involve alot of hacking.

So everyone else ? whats your opinion on the ideas ? or put up your opinion or idea.

Thats not the difference between black and whitehat. Actually at this very moment black and whitehats dont really exist anymore, why? Because these terms were used during the cold war, you had the whitehats who hacked to protect their networks and blackhats who tried to attack the western society. (Very breef definition)

But i dont understand how you can find bat-code interessting, i mean truely if you compare them, do you see any difference? Well i dont its always the same

set /p iplist="file with ips: "
for /F "eol=; tokens=1*" %%i in (%iplist%) do (...)

It's always the same, so why bother posting them?

Sorry delete this reply, i have to skip, got some work to do till midnight or something :/

OK, I guess it is about time I chime in. I would like to congratulate the majority of everyone who has responded with some sort of restraint. I would also like to congradulate jetprice for responding to the commenst athat were posted about his post instead of simply posting his comment and then disappearing. So instaed of this post simply becoming a rant aboiut how GSO sucks I have gotten to here some very honest opinions about how this forum is run.

First yes we do have a skiddie problem. I will be the first to admit it. But we (and I say that loosly since I am not always the most active defense again the skiddie hordes, I rely on the mods as well as comsec for most of that) continuously attempt to fight back. The majority of the individuals that I have received hatemail from as well as the majority of the posts on other forums that I find about GSO seem to insinuate the fact that we are to tough. Many people have found it offensive that we delete user accounts and that we close memberships for so long. Now I understand that you believe we should continue to crack down harder, and we of course will, but deciding on how to do this is not an easy task. I believe that we have been diligent on deleting posts that do not fit in with the forum rules, and such idiotic things as "Thanks" posts have been reduced quit nicely by the likes of bearded nose. My challenge to is to keep the suggestions coming. For people having so many opinions about this site, the GSO suggestions section is dreadfully bare.

Now your comments about this site being so much better 3 years ago in a way is true. I miss those days as well, that was when, dare I quote a classic American TV show "every body knows your name", I knew the guys who were here, many were friends from other boards that came over here to start something better then where we were. At the time we were allexcited about how we were going to making things more interesting, and be able to discuss things that no ther board would allow you to discuss. Well very quickly it became evident that we were not the only people who were also interested in discussing such topics, and then exchanging files, and within our first year of the forum we were having 1200 signups for user accounts evry day. Pretty soon we began to have major growing pains. How do you deal with so many people. There is not many websites that you can use as example to follow with the numbers that we have as well as the content type we have. Now I hope I do not offend anywebmasters with my following comments: Blackcode? They are overun with kiddies as well, Astalavista.net? They have some talent but they are a pay service which keeps some of the kiddies at bay, AntiOnline? Not the same content type, similar but not the same.

If someone has a site that we should model ourselves then please tell me.

As of right now I have been extremly tempted to just lock the site down and only keep a ver small and select few users. In reality where is the benefit of having this massive user base? Nothing really.

The thing that we have consistantly struggled with is how do we properly bring in new blood. Just like any forum if you do not have new users then the forum will die. So previously we have been opening memberships for about a week and then sifting through the fools. If someone has a better idea feel free to tell me.

which of you script kiddie pricks banned clubfed for false reasons? jetprice was 100% correct and didn't go nearly far enough in describing how disgusting this site has become. You practice censorship and irresponsible membership status/banning at an insane level. clubfed had several hundred QUALITY posts, not a single one-sentence lame "thanks" or "how do i..." etc post among them, did absolutely nothing wrong, but was banned -- because he asked a QUESTION about why someone else was banned. clubfed had *nothing to do with* whatever the original issue was, he simply asked a question about the censorship, wanting to know what was censored.

I see people become full members who are drooling IDIOTS, who beg for compiles, and extremely skilled people marginalized and banned. wtf!


this makes sense -- comparing this site to AntiOnline - the long-time laughing stock of the security scene, JP right along with Caroline Meinel. pure lame. so much potential but so little delivery :/


The best security site on the net is probably SecurityFocus.. however they don't have a web forum, and GSO is pretty much JUST a forum, so there is not much comparison. However if you want to see a site done right, look no further than SF. (packetstorm also gets kudos, though they are file-focused and their forums have never really taken off).


go ahead and close up your little club, see how long it lasts. set aside the fact that you are unfairly commandeering the contributions of hundreds/thousands of people who posted their ideas and technical information, and treating it like it has become your private property. asshole.

it occurs to me that you (admin and others) may read what i'm saying here and not understand when i talk about how there are members who are sht stupid, but skilled people who are kept down in trial status. so i think maybe i'll just give some quick examples so you'll understand.

you know, fck that its not worth my time. just look at this ONE recent thread for an example: http://www.governmentsecurity.org/forum/in...showtopic=14585

notice that the thread itself is useless - why talk about having deleted 0-post users? but then look at the replies from these "full members". i mean WHAT THE FCK. look at these brilliant displays of technical prowess! how they elegantly explore personal firewall subversion, virus and antivirus technologies, dissect the latest round of 0day security information from the last conference, post new information, discuss new ideas, etc... just look at how valuable these posts are!:

"good job...althought it must have taken some time hehe"
"Well Done ComSec Bye Bye 0 posters"
"Thanks! I feel so CLEAN now!"
"hehe at last, DB is cleaner, board is cleaner, peeps are happier"
"Very nice! Now get rid of the rotten apples and you have a nice board."
"GOD DAMNIT there goes my 14,000 backup accounts !"
"Well you know what its like when you dont trim your hair for say 6 months and sooner you`ll be looking like a tree up there. I too believe that keeping the board clean is always a task of priority. goodwork comsec...."

i mean JESUS FCK!! look at the quality of those posts! Looks like you have to SUCK THE ASS OF THE ADMIN to be a "member" here, and prove your 31337 aol roots with a "lol" here and a "hehe" there. un-fcking-real.

Why should I or any of the other people who can consistently contribute intelligent dialog and good code, have to post in limited areas and be marginalized while IDIOTS are given membership. Think the word idiot is too harsh?? How about LOLHEHE'er ? *pure* *kiddies* *all*

Yes I'm blowing the cover of this account "smarty" by posting the truth, so what, I posted quality here and wasn't given membership anyway (perhaps i sound too independent and free-thinking like clubfed?) so you can take this account and shove it up your gaping ass. I wrote the admin half a dozen times about the injustice that occured with clubfed, each time with no response. I could take down this site (i have over 500 10mb connections at my disposal and i know how to use them) but its not worth the few loses i would have. revenge means nothing when you are striking down at GNATS. I don't hate you, I *pity* you.

My advice is fire whatever piece of sht has been wrongfully banning skilled people and promoting idiots, get his ass OUT OF POWER, and bring in some new blood with skill and patience and intelligence. Let them fix up that damaged nature of this otherwise excellent resource. Get rid of the idiotic "trial member" status and level the playing field. If you have a problem SHARING information and want to be an immature tw4t (you censor the word tw4t, turning it into "cool dude"?? idiots!) who hordes files, then set a RATIO on it. It's not like you people created original content, 99.99% of the content is from other sources anyway -- you are not a unique and beautiful snowflake Not even close.

Also, drop the idiotic pretense that this board is anything but a kiddie haven. This site has NOTHING to do with securing resources, system administration, defense and monitoring, honeypot technology -- and everything to do with "what port does this exploit" "lol hehe" "how d0 1 c0mpile?" .. :/

sad!

ps. what's really sad, is watch how fast these ineffectual limp wrists censor/ban me instead of answering up for their mistakes. pathetic.



smarty/ aka clubfed

ok this has gone far enough. we try our best to keep the forum clean but clearly not everyone will be happy all the time.



Smarty, can any issues you have with GSO be discussed in private? I am saddened that any member would threaten the board with illegal ddos.

I am closing this thread for the time being.

OK if we can return to a moral civil form of communication then I would like to keep this topic open so that some constructive comments can be had.

News to me


Tell me where i said bat code is interesting? I said the garbage is useful because i know what people are up to. Nothing to do with the usefulness of the code.

Not saying that autohackers are a good thing, just that i can glean some information from them (NOT how they work but how they affect me).

And therefor you need constantly new YAAH's lol mate please... this is going beyond my imagination. Also i mixed up batcode and autohackers, i hoped you would notice this, but its my error.

Nup, but if they're there I may glance at them from time to time.
Read the first paragraph of my first post you will see that i am not specifically referring to "YAAH's", but the garbage as a whole.

Sorry if there was any misunderstanding, i dont wish to turn this into a back and forth nitpicking war so i'll stop here

I've read bits and pieces of this from the beginning and there are some validated points by everyone at the beginning of this thread I believe. But from the perspective of Don't post this, or why allow that, or who did this, or why'd ya do that.I feel compelled to say the following.

I enjoy this board because it allows a multitude of parties to communicate and exchange ideas, and points of view. Just as you have done JetPrice, Smarty

You've made several comments JetPrice and your claim to being a Whitehat, or maybe I misinterpreted your comment and shortly I see the comment of no black/white hats.

As with all aspects I find most forms of communication will provide insight into some form of information. Just as the comments I mentioned above.

You may want to see things done one way or the other, but one has to give credit where credit is due and that is bottom line the Mods/Admins due a kick butt job.

One you look into the scope of this forum, as well as the people doing regular work, side jobs, family time, travel etc. etc. You have to admit that they are doing what they can with the time given and it has been a great job. More so than some of the other forums or locations I visitied in the past. Now if actions by yourself, a friend, or road dawg caused someone to get the boot, ban, or clipped then there probably was a good reason.

Yes there is always some form of information in a communcation. All depends on what your looking for.

Spookie

Jetprice, I do NOT think you know all the effort that the admins/mods put in. I'm a mod, and I know somewhat what the admins have to put up with and do to keep this going. Fighting the crap that comes in is huge, as you well know, and a tough job. But even I don't know half of what the others have done...I just know my experience has been tough, but rewarding.



That was my comment....When you get as many posts reported to you as I do, you breathe a lot easier and take less baths when you know the carnage will be down a bit. Less skiddies to deal with!

I also like to inject quite a bit of humor into my posts (SQL injection, I've found, is much easier), so I make silly comments like the one above...that one happened to have a lot of truth behind it, however.

Also, having a thread about 0 posters lets folks know what's going on, especially the mods; you get less questions from members also.

At the same time, I won't tell you that I can defend all the posts that you find objectionable. It's a matter of taste. Yes, some stuff is tasteless to many, and we try to deal with that. But as I learned in this thread, some find the skiddie stuff useful. It's okay if you disagree.

I found it interesting that you couldn't recommend any other forum other than SFDC. I read that one too, but skip over a ton of the posts as they don't interest me at all. While I enjoy humor, I'm glad GSO doesn't allow humor posts like blonde jokes, etc. To me, that's a waste of time. Others enjoy it.

While you have certainly shown restraint in your responses, I wonder if you couldn't have received similar results with less fire...you think not, but try it sometime..especially here at GSO.

Back to the skiddies....the problem is that we could do a better job killing off their acocunts and deleting their posts, and we surely could interview members for admitance or promotion, but we only have so much time. Somedays, I hate to log into GSO cuz I know I'll have to deal with PMs about this and that. It's a tough problem....

I don't understand why you stick around...if you can't be happy picking and choosing from what GSO offers, then I wish you the best.

p.s. I don't think your English is bad at all. In fact, had you not mentioned it, I would never have thought about it.

I only read the first few posts to this thread, but I would like to reply to the original post, and I'm sorry if I repeat anything anybody else said.


This is a very common problem and I have heard this said on many big forums. It is nearly impossible to have a board with a decent user base that does not have this problem. If you start banning everyone that posts anything skiddieish, you end up with a board of a few elitists, which is probably cool with those few elitists, but for everyone else it sucks. I love smart people, but I hate smart people who don't help others, and constantly put people down for asking stupid questions. The only situation I will accept that is when someone is trolling a forum and asking stupid questions on purpose.


This is a sort of gray line for me. In my opinion, exploits which are released should not need to be modified. I have been trying to learn about exploits for a long time now, and it's very difficult. The first exploit I ever used I had to get someone to compile it for me. I have never used any exploit against a computer I did not have permission to or that wasn't my own. I think someone wishing to make sure that they are not vulnerable to a certain exploit should not have to have an intermediate to advanced level of knowledge about programming. Maybe the only reason I think like this is because I do not have malicious intent. For all I know complete chaos could break loose if anyone could compile an exploit. Like I said, it's a gray line .

Just my thoughts.

Ok i`ve joined this board just recently obviously i have seen not so-called
rubbish being posted yet. Afterall modZ/adminZ also keep an eye open dont
they?

First of all this board is not producing hackers lol who said it was?
this is a place for proZ to discuss/share their knowledge in regards to
security. Correct me if im wrong !

Let me make my point, security is not just firewalls and AVs, its more
and its deeper. So people discuss their own topics in which they feel
confortable and can explain much better.

I see that you have been harsh in your posts (which is never a valid
way to solve problems). You have flamed up and everyone could see that
even without being infront of you. If you asked me, in your just first
2 posts i would say you were taking it far too personal than you should
have. I also noticed that you have made more than 5 posts just telling
the users that GSO stands nowhere and its full of kiddie sh#t. Whats
your point? the impression i get is you are calling yourself far more
better than the rest of the users here. I dont blame you that was a
header file compiled with the program human.exe hehe.

You say that you want GSO to improve, fair enough. You have the rights
to say that but you posting degrading threads like these, it would only
level-down the image even at the user level at any board. If you need
to express an idea on reputation or making a board look better, PM THE
MODS & ADMINS.

Like i said, i am new to the board yes, but so far i`ve liked the posts
and the people here are not just kiddieZ. I am a security consultant,
did my research degree at IT Security and my field of thesis was

Steganography. Its true none of my previous posts relate to my
specified field YET, call me lazy then

Anyway, we are not degrading you or anything, just keep the anger aside
while posting cuz really i have as well found this board a place for
ADULTS to discuss security.

SO i`ll make my point here again NO ONE HERE IS A SCRIPT KIDDIE.
Everyone specializes in their own field and might be a master of it.
Not many developers necessarily would be able to play with registries as
well. So there you go ...



P.S: you said you wouldnt stay here anymore, believe me this forum
thing isnt easy to be kept clean.


PP.S: a board is a place where professionals meet and discuss if
everyone was a MASTER they would sit at homes watching football LOL


PPP.S: IF YOU KNOW MORE, SHARE IT OR USE IT. ALL THE UNUSED INFO CAN
GET ROTTEN INSIDE OF YOU.

<NO OFFENCE PACKETS SENT OR RECIEVED - COnnection ended>

Yes, I WAS a script kiddy, but also they learn and they are also human beings with feelings .

Now i am learning how to code, how to see opportunities and use opportunities, gather more info, don't look @ other systems then to ones you own. Not making lame botnets/stro's etc.

You should consider that we didn't all start at the top like you seem to be.

JetPrice,

If your spending this much effort on something, be proactive with your efforts. You seem to be enlightened in this kind of thing, knowing about it and have been a member from the start apparently.

Tell us where we went wrong, how you would fix it/prevented it.

Explain to us where our downfalls are?

Give some resolutions to these downfalls?

And I'm calling all other users to the table to, lets hear it and take the proactive approach to fixing what this "complaint" is stating, instead of sitting hear tossing opinions at one another.

Ever heard a pound of theory is only worth an ounce of action.

Lets start with the action and screw the theory crap because at the moment, it's gotten Jetprice and everybody else nowhere.

Hi,

I agree with most opinions posted in this thread and i understand what concerns you jetprice.
Anyway, what i don't appreciate is the way you are acting like ur ALOT better then some of us.
But as far as i can see, i see no constibutions from you, and i don't really care if you did a while ago under a other name.
The only thing i say is that you should'nt crack ppl down with tools they made.
39% of your posts (total of 40 posts) have been made at the file download forum, and they are all complaints and crackdowns.
Like many ppl before me said: "What makes this board so unique is the fact that it has so many grey and black hats on it"
Everybody has to start somewhere, even you.
I know i am a skiddie, but atleast i don't crack ppl down, and i try to give (positive) help to ppl.

Flame me if you want, but that proves only im right.

FLX

p.s http://www.governmentsecurity.org/forum/in...sult_type=posts

yes FLX nice job posting the link under your thread.......clearly shows most threads by jetprice which were a jet of criticism...... well anyway alot of criticism leads to nothing but criticism, so what the use.......

anyway i wont bother reading further posts on this topic anymore, cuz its just leading nowhere...... seems like everyone is trying their level best to convince a person, which isnt the moto of this board..... anyway goodluck jetprice

P.S: and i do think that this thread should be locked down, no further comments..


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